What does it take to lift someone out of hatred? How do we reach that friend or family member who has disturbing views? And what if they’re not an average everyday person—what if they’re someone who’s been groomed since birth to lead the American white nationalist movement?
It turns out that for all of the above, what’s needed is the same: friendship, support, and time. Lots and lots of time.
Eli Saslow’s Rising Out of Hatred is the powerful true story of Derek Black, a young white nationalist leader who not only came to disavow his former beliefs, but who now works to undo the harm he once did, warning about the recent rise of white nationalism and describing what helped transform his own thinking. Thought-provoking, entertaining, and instructive, the book tells the story of a mind that changed. Just as importantly, it shows how we all might reach the people in our lives who seem unreachable.
Derek is the son of Don Black—a former KKK Grand Wizard who founded the popular white nationalist website Stormfront—and the godson of David Duke. As a teen, Derek became heir-apparent to Duke’s throne, convincing many American white nationalists to distance themselves from violence so they could enter the political mainstream.
Rising Out of Hatred is set against the surge in white nationalism since Obama’s election in 2008, including painful events like Trayvon Martin’s death at the hands of George Zimmerman in 2012 and Dylan Roof’s massacre of nine Black churchgoers in 2015.
And, of course, this period also saw the political rise of Donald Trump, whose campaign rhetoric often parroted the language of the new, sanitized white nationalism Derek Black had helped create. Although many conservatives would be deeply offended at white nationalist beliefs, Saslow’s book shows how this poisonous ideology has still seeped into the far right and the Republican Party.
The slow, incremental change in Black’s thinking—away from his white nationalist beliefs—began when he went away to a small liberal arts college and formed friendships with students from diverse backgrounds. His story is a testament to how friendship can help free someone from hatred, illustrating how persuasion typically happens: not with “gotcha” statements or grand epiphanies, but through patient conversation over time and gradual, barely perceptible shifts.
That’s where Black’s story is instructive for all of us, whether we’re talking to a white nationalist or an ordinary person who holds offensive beliefs.
Changing minds requires patience, patience, patience.
I first heard about Rising Out of Hatred at a campfire with a friend who was halfway through it but was feeling disheartened. Although she recommended Saslow’s book, she was discouraged by how much time and effort it took to change Black’s mind.
At college, Black was befriended by an Orthodox Jew who invited him to weekly Shabbat dinners. But even after more than a year of attending the meals, and endless discussions with a progressive woman who eventually became Black’s girlfriend, he still showed little sign of changing his beliefs. Reading his story, my own friend was overwhelmed. If it takes this long, this many conversations to change one person’s mind, then how are we ever going to reach the millions of Americans who believe in conspiracy theories and harbor prejudice?
But even as she lamented this to me, I felt more hopeful. After a decade of involvement with political dialogue, I know it takes time to build trust and change minds, if they’re going to change at all. It often does take years, and it happens very gradually. But it does happen.
And Derek Black is an extreme case. He wasn’t just someone’s isolated uncle dabbling in conspiracy theories; he’d lived and breathed white nationalism all his life. Disavowing it meant creating an irreparable rift with his entire family, so of course it took him years to be able to take this leap—but he eventually did. I can’t help but find hope in that.
Friendship really is magic. (The My Little Ponies are right!)
The key to Black’s transformation was his fellow students. At first, he kept quiet on campus about his white nationalism, but soon he was outed, and Saslow captures the dilemma his peers faced. What would you do if you learned there was a white nationalist at your school? And not just any white nationalist, but a white nationalist leader?
A heated debate ensued. Many students advocated shunning Black—ostracizing him to show he was unwelcome, pressuring him to either change or leave the school. Others used stronger language, and at times he feared for his physical safety on campus.
But some students thought it might be possible to change his mind, and a few reached out to him. They came from various backgrounds, including a progressive white woman, an immigrant from Peru, and the Orthodox Jew, who was also one of the few conservatives on campus. They didn’t know whether their efforts would work, but they believed it was worth a try.
Later, in an email to a reporter, Black described the role these friendships played in his transformation:
People who disagreed with me were critical…. Especially those who were my friends regardless, but who let me know when we talked about it that they thought my beliefs were wrong and took the time to provide evidence and civil arguments. I didn’t always agree with their ideas, but I listened to them and they listened to me.
Furthermore, a critical juncture was when I’d realize that a friend was considered an outsider by the philosophy I supported. It’s a huge contradiction to share your summer plans with someone whom you completely respect, only to then realize that your ideology doesn’t consider them a full member of society. I couldn’t resolve that.
Black’s friends didn’t pretend they agreed with him. At some point, all of them let him know they abhorred his beliefs. But they expressed their anger in an authentic, humanizing way, allowing their friendship to transcend their outrage and slowly affect Black’s worldview.
…But not everyone has to make friends.
Still, the message of Rising Out of Hatred isn’t that everyone should befriend white nationalists. In fact, along with authenticity and friendship, there was a third powerful force in Black’s transformation: isolation. He tried to shrug it off, but he was inwardly distressed by the many students who did shun him. As Saslow writes:
The loneliness made him wonder about his future, and whether a public role in white nationalism could ever be worth so much exclusion.
Black’s few friendships were meaningful partly because there were so few of them. The pressure of ostracism can play a role in persuasion—when it comes to hate and oppression, not everyone needs to do the work of reaching out. People who are traumatized, fearful, or exhausted can step back and still potentially make an impact, especially if it’s clear why they’re withdrawing.
At the same time, though, someone needs to do the work of reaching out. Isolation alone won’t change anyone’s mind. Without friendship, isolation often reinforces false or hateful ideologies, because the need to belong is a powerful driving force in conspiracy theories and hate. A person will only emerge from extremism if they can find belonging somewhere else.
Black’s isolation was useful because it focused his energy on the few authentic friendships he did have. His example reminds us that reaching out to those with offensive or harmful views is essential work—not work for everyone, but work that should be valued, encouraged, and supported.
A story of hope…and motivation
Rising Out of Hatred offers a blueprint for change in a society mired in division and racial tension. It shows there’s hope—that even someone in the depths of white nationalism can see the light. Change may happen slowly, especially with someone so indoctrinated, but it can happen. And it’s up to us to help it along.
Reading Derek Black’s story, I was inspired by the maturity and intelligence of his friends and of Black himself. He grew up immersed in a despicable philosophy and did a lot of harm. But he was a child when he learned to do that harm, and through intelligence, thoughtfulness, and the patience of his friends, he found his way out of hatred.
Each of us can learn from his journey as we struggle with our own conversations on racism, both nationally and personally. Seeing how internal change really happens—slowly, supported by brave and patient friendship—offers hope in a dark time.
Many thanks to Locke Peterseim for assistance editing this piece.
